Henry Rollins on His Trip to North Korea

Episode Summary

Main Topics Discussed

• Henry Rollins recounts his challenging trip to North Korea, which took three years to secure a visa.
• His experience traveling during the "last days of Kim Jong-il," highlighting the pervasive propaganda and strict surveillance.
• The necessity of concealing his identity as a musician/artist/public figure to avoid scrutiny and potential detention in highly controlled nations.
• A similar harrowing experience in Iran, where his public identity was nearly exposed, forcing a swift, emergency departure.

Key Insights & Memorable Moments

• Rollins described North Korea as "just sad," characterized by fear among its people and constant suspicion from authorities.
• He was assigned "two tour spies"—a polite one and a "mean one who just scalled and took notes"—who interrogated him daily.
• A tense moment where his North Korean tour guide, previously speaking broken English, suddenly became fluent when questioning how other tourists recognized Rollins.
• The profound relief felt upon the plane taking off from North Korea, escaping the constant anxiety of potential capture.
• The revelation that artists and public figures are generally denied entry to such countries due to fear of what they might report or influence.
• In Iran, Rollins had a handler who advised him to hide his profession from the government tour guide, only for his identity to be discovered by a relative watching TV, leading to an immediate, urgent evacuation to the airport.

Notable Quotes or Revelations

• "It took three years to get that Visa... it was just sad."
• "My tour guides since I went there alone they were very suspicious of me so they they put two tour spies on me."
• "If I'm caught being in movies, writing books, rock and roll, I'm going downtown for a meeting that I might not get out of."
• Recalling his tour guide's sudden fluency: "All of a sudden his English was as good as mine, I'm like oh no."
• On artists entering these countries: "They won't let you in if you're an artist, absolutely, absolutely not, 'cause they just they fear it."
• Reflecting on the consequences of being caught: "Questions which leads to more questions and you just don't know it turns into like well he's been interrogated for the last three months and we don't know and since I'm not a hot-looking girl President Clinton's not coming to rescue me."

Overall Themes

The discussion highlights the themes of governmental control and surveillance in totalitarian states, where information is strictly managed and fear is a tool of power. It delves into the personal risks and psychological toll of traveling in such environments, especially for public figures whose identity can become a liability. The narratives underscore the stark contrast between free societies and those where basic freedoms are suppressed, emphasizing the inherent dangers and challenges faced by anyone venturing into these controlled territories.