Joe Rogan Experience #634 - Abby Martin

Episode Summary

Main Topics Discussed

• Abby Martin's Tenure at Russia Today (RT): Her experience working for the Russian state-funded news network, the editorial freedom she was granted, and her eventual departure due to a forced assignment in Crimea.
• Media Bias and Propaganda: A deep dive into the nature of propaganda, the inherent biases in all media sources (both state-funded and corporate), and the importance of media literacy.
• US-Russia Relations and Proxy Wars: Discussion on the current state of tension, parallels to the Cold War, and the existence of proxy conflicts in Ukraine and Syria where US and Russian interests clash.
• Political Assassinations and Suspicious Deaths: Examination of various historical and contemporary cases, including Vince Foster, Martin Luther King Jr., the Kennedys, and the controversial death of Joe Scarborough's intern, Lori Klausutis.
• The Anthrax Attacks Investigation: A detailed recount of the post-9/11 anthrax letters, the flawed FBI investigation, the blaming of different individuals, and recent revelations about hidden evidence and a lawsuit by the lead FBI agent.
• Disillusionment with the Two-Party System: Abby Martin's strong criticism of both the Democratic and Republican parties in the US, seeing them as perpetuating similar harmful policies.

Key Insights & Memorable Moments

• Abby Martin left RT after the network issued a press release stating she would be "shipped" to Crimea, which she saw as an attempt to control her narrative, stating, "I just didn't want it to be a vetted press experience for me."
• She defended her decision to work for RT by arguing it offered "unmatched" editorial freedom to critique the US government and corporations because it was not beholden to corporate advertisers, despite its Russian funding.
• Joe Rogan highlighted the irony that RT gained credibility by covering the Occupy movement when mainstream US media largely ignored or ridiculed it.
• The discussion pointed out how US officials like John Kerry used RT as an example of effective foreign propaganda to advocate for more funding for US propaganda arms like Radio Free Europe and Voice of America.
• A memorable moment involved Jamie (Rogan's producer) researching the mysterious death of Joe Scarborough's intern, Lori Klausutis, in his office in 2001, uncovering details about an inconclusive autopsy, a revoked medical license for the examiner, and persistent public suspicion.
• Abby Martin vividly detailed the Anthrax attacks: the immediate blaming of Saddam Hussein, the later discovery that the strain came from a US bioweapons lab, the false accusations against Dr. Steven Hatfill, the suspicious suicide of Dr. Bruce Ivins, and the recent lawsuit by the lead FBI agent alleging withheld exculpatory evidence.
• She expressed deep concern about the "proxy wars" in Ukraine and Syria, stating that "the war is already happening it's just through different mediums" between the US and Russia.

Notable Quotes or Revelations

• Abby Martin on working for RT: "If I have to work for the Russian government to tell the truth about what's happening in my country, that's what I'm going to do because I we have to get the information out there."
• Abby Martin on propaganda: "The editorial Freedom that RT gives is completely unmatched... everything is propaganda. Every [expletive] thing is propaganda."
• Abby Martin on RT's unique value: "You may not get the truth about Russia from going to Russia Today and watching Russia today but you will get the [expletive] truth about the US government and you will get the truth about corporations because it's state funded."
• Abby Martin on the Anthrax investigation: "Best case scenario on the anthrax attacks is that there's still a bioweapons terrorist running around free that's the best case scenario worst case scenario is that the government is complicit."
• Revelation about Lori Klausutis: The discovery that Joe Scarborough's intern was found dead in his office in 2001, ruled a fall due to an undiagnosed heart condition, but surrounded by numerous suspicious details including the medical examiner's controversial background.
• Revelation about the Anthrax case: The FBI agent in charge of the Anthrax investigation is suing the government, claiming they "purposefully hid evidence that proved that Bruce Ivans was not the perpetrator."

Overall Themes

• Media Skepticism and Critical Thinking: A pervasive theme is the need to be skeptical of all news sources, understand their inherent biases, and actively seek out diverse perspectives to discern truth amidst pervasive propaganda.
• Government Accountability and Transparency: The episode repeatedly questions official narratives, especially concerning politically charged deaths and investigations, highlighting a deep distrust in government institutions and their willingness to reveal inconvenient truths.
• The Murkiness of Global Politics: The discussion emphasizes the "odd shades of gray" in international relations, challenging simplistic black-and-white views of countries like Russia and highlighting the complex and often covert nature of geopolitical conflicts.
• Anti-Establishment Sentiment: Abby Martin's perspective, supported by Joe Rogan, reflects a strong anti-establishment stance, criticizing the two-party system, corporate media, and powerful political figures for perpetuating harmful policies and obscuring truth.